Mixing Religion with Politics (continuation …)


I see your point Lee, and of course I want to point out that I do NOT mean to brand a whole “race” (the Arabs in this case) as terrorists, and I have nothing to say to those who with one hand supports Christianity and with the other is hating Islam.
I’d rather cut of both hands if that’s the case … 🙂

I’m against Islam as its dominating role in World politics. I don’t think Islam has anything positive to give to the world how it is right now and I don’t believe a second that Islam could be combined with a modern civilized democratic society who respects and supports democratic values for its citizens.
This combined with a strong belief in the fact that religion (whatever you guys wish to call those fairy tales that you chose to control your lives) and politics combined will always result in a catastrophe … Just look at the Bush administration. The last thing we need are Christian missionaries and/or religious hate-mongers in the White House or anywhere in the world. And fact is Lee that this is not “a small percentage” we are talking about among the Palestinian population. The support for terrorism and theocratic rule is humongous among the Muslims. Do we really need another Iran that bad?

But if it makes you happy I can broadcast a picture of another type of radicals who I hate as much as I hate Muslim militants – Nazi Swedes. It will make the blog slightly less biased probably, which is good. Here you have a bunch of asswipes *yey, white-supremacist MILFs*.

Religion has to step back .. especially in the Middle East but also in the US .. and clear the way for Politics, businessmen/women and manufacturers. When people realize it is much more fun to trade and earn money instead of quarreling about who’s made-up superhero/God told their ancestors 438384 years ago that they could have that crappy piece of sandbox *hem*, sorry, I mean Israel/Palestine, not until then will people understand that peace is better than war and loving is better than killing. Only free trade and hardcore Adam Smithanian-liberalism can solve this conflict.

Talking about Adam Smith. We can end this tiresome quarrel with a suitable quote from ‘da man’ himself:

“If not commodities and wares will cross borders, soldiers will.”

//Adam Smith

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About tegis

This blog belongs to Carl-Mikael A. Teglund - tegis. Swedish emigrant with a heart for languages, philosophy, history, and politics (classical liberalism in the European tradition). Go ahead and look, read, or listen. I'm sure you will find it interesting.
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15 Responses to Mixing Religion with Politics (continuation …)

  1. William says:

    “If not commodities and wares will cross borders, soldiers will.” I do love that statement.

    You need to look at the core beliefs of religions. I don’t think Islam as a whole will ever have anything positive to add to humanity. The core belief system of Islam is based on intolerance and hatred. For Christians that hate muslims, they in the end are no better. Hate the belief and not the sad individual that is stuck with it.

    Christianity in its core belief is not about intolerance or hatred. It took the religious fanatics to improve upon Jesus’ teachings. Christianity is not supposed to interfere with governments but again fundamentalists have improved on the teachings. If you were to follow the fundamental beliefs of Christianity, you would not need any type of socialism from your government.

    Judaism really comes from a theocratic society and in many aspects is similiar to both Islam and Christianity.

    Might as well as look at atheism, where all of us atheists strut around pretending we are something that we are not. Atheists are nothing more than a mixture of all the others with the belief in our mystical supreme being is that inject it into ourselves.

  2. tegis says:

    Christianity is exactly as evil as Islam is. If you are a Christian and criticize Islam you undermine your trustworthiness.
    I agree that Islam has its flaws but so does Christianity. Islam has a far better view on for instance justice where you are judged in Islam by your good and bad actions but in Christianity you can be as bad as you want but then one day say “OK Jesus, I believe in you, I have sinned, forgive me!” And then all your sins disappear, and how just is that? The thing that Islam should be built on hate or something like that is just exactly that kind of narrow-minded attitude we need less of in the world. And religion seems to create these attitudes, where people growing up in environs where people say that “the others, they believe in wrong things”. Christianity has fucked up America, without its serious theocratic tendencies, it would be the jolliest country in the world.
    Now it’s pretty scary in some states …

  3. William says:

    You are confusing religion with governmental idiologies. Look at the base of these two religions.
    Islam is based on violence and hatred. I’ve read the Koran, Qur’an or however you want to call it. I’ve studied other texts concerning it and came away very early in my age that it is a religion not too different than that of Nazism or cults such as Jim Jones. This is not some post-2001 attitude but an attitude that a 13 year old invested in some 25 years ago to find the truth about God. These terrorists are doing what their religion tells them. They are not fanatics but followers. Religion and govermental rule are intertwined within Islam.
    Christianity at its base is more philosophical and has nothing to do with what we can call earthly judgements. “Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s” is a perfect example of true Christianity. This is why a Christian can face his God and be forgiven. It is NO different than I as a parent forgiving my son for his screw-ups. In the end the Christian God loves the Christian as a father does his child. Christianity in its true form cares not about governmental rule. This does not exonerate Christians for their horrors. As I stated earlier, many Christians have decided to improve upon Jesus’ teaching by adding many of the values Mohammed preached.
    Even atheism creates the same attitudes that you lay upon relgions. I should know! I am just as phony as all the other atheists. I no longer find the need to scream and put down others to prove how inferior they are (I find Islam a threat to humanity just as I view any dictatorship as a threat). I realize that there is no difference between any of us other than what we are willing to do for our belief or our “non-belief”.
    Christianity hasn’t screwed up America. In fact I really don’t think America is screwed up. It’s just in transition. Question, have you visited America? I wonder what you consider to be screwed up.

  4. William says:

    I want to apologize for directing this to an area that was unintended and not needed for the argument.

    What my original intent was to say that Islam was more predisposed towards a theocratic rule. In my opinion Islam was intentionally designed for this. I place Christianity as a rule of the individual within the individual and not a theocratic design. Even a non-religious rule could be just as terrible.

    My belief that any religion in a theocratic state is oppressive no matter what good intentions there are. Even a official state religion can be wrong as well; this is why the Pilgrims came to America. Going hand in hand with religion is any belief system where the state rules for the good of the people such as Socialism, totalitarianism or any other such ism.

    My question to you Carl is legitimate. I am curious why you would think so.

  5. Giulia Guidi says:

    “in Christianity you can be as bad as you want but then one day say “OK Jesus, I believe in you, I have sinned, forgive me!” And then all your sins disappear, and how just is that?”

    Actually, Cristians believe in hell: God’s forgiveness is therefore not automatic, otherwise hell would be totally empty! 😉

    Faith is the necessary condition to be saved, but it is by no means sufficient.

    The Islamic hell is actually milder: The turture and suffering only last for a limited period of time, then they end and you may go to heaven. The Christian hell, on the other hand, is eternal! 😉

  6. Giulia Guidi says:

    I actually meant to write “torture,” not “turture,” but I am watching a documentary about “turtles” and I got the two words mixed up! 😉

    Here is a brief quote from Wikipedia: “The Qur’an also says that some of those who are damned to Hell are not damned forever, but instead for an indefinite period of time. In any case, there is good reason to believe that punishment in Hell is not meant to actually last eternally, but instead serves as a basis for spiritual rectification.”

  7. tegis says:

    Hi William and sorry for my late reply but I’ve been flying (literally) around a lot lately.
    And yes, I have lived in the States. In Rhode Island to be exact (even though it is not important, you should be able to comment on things going on in Cuba or in Venezuela without living there, what a strange world we would have otherwise).
    I totally agree with you on the point that Islam tells us more about how a society in fact ought to be run. That’s why I do not believe that Islam and democracy can be combined. Maybe secular Islam can, but first this form has to be accepted by the majority of Muslim followers. I don’t think that’s the case right now. What the Koran is NOT built upon however is “hatred” as you put it. That is just pure ignorance from your side. Islam was formed, historically speaking, because of the loose political system and the lack of law and discipline in the 7th century Middle East. Law and order was needed, no one could offer it, Muhammed wrote down some laws in a book and said they were divine and that the people had to obey them otherwise they would burn in hell. Simple as that.
    But the Koran is the same shit as the Bible. It says yes to a question on one place and no at another place. Without these safety measures taken, a religion wouldn’t last for long.
    You talk about the Pilgrims. That makes me glad. They also advocated for theocratic rule. Remember that! Cromwell putted these wicked plans into practice and formed a dictatorship in 17th century England that can only be compared in evilness together with Pol Pot’s Cambodia or Stalin’s Russia.
    If Islam is a religion of hatred, Christianity is not far away. Remember that Christians do not respect people who doesn’t want to follow the mainstream sexual pattern and choose other ways and that they refuse women the right to decide over their own bodies.
    If that is hillbilly ignorance or hatred I don’t know. Probably the truth is somewhere in the middle.

  8. tegis says:

    Giulia, isn’t that the same kind of heaven as Catholics has? In Sweden we call it “Skärselden”, and it is a fire that will purify your soul until it is clean enough for heaven. 🙂 Like God’s own wicked washing machine or such … 🙂

  9. William says:

    I was curious how you based your opinion on how America was screwed up. This was not to say that if you never spent time here you could not comment. I was curious as to where you based your opinion.
    I believe you really do not understand the dynamics of America. In fact even Americans truly do not understand the dynamics. What occurs in Rhode Island is vastly different that South Carolina and yet a casual observer would see nothing different.

    You simplify the origination of Islam. In fact we are leaving a lot out of the origination of Islam. I have read the Koran and yes, in my opinion, there is nothing peaceful and it brings to mind a set of rules. Yes, Islam allows the killing of non-muslims where as Christianity does not allow the murder of non-believers.

    Are Christians not allowed to voice their opinions on sex and abortion. Let’s call it what it is, please. Where in the New Testament does it say to kill those fornicating out of marriage or women allowing the death of an unborn fetus? As I stated earlier, there are people that believe the end justify the means. These people are wrong with respect to Christianity and the core beliefs just as it is wrong for those that “shun” me because I profess to be an atheist.

    Giula, the forgiveness for a Christian and his deity is between himself and his deity. If his God chooses to keep him wailing and gnashing his teething for eternity then so be it. The same goes for the mythical Allah. It is the belief on Earth that matters to me. We can go on about theology if you want, but unless you are a theologian or someone that studies religions, it is too easy to not understand what we are discussing. Even though I’ve studied religion for over 20 years, my knowledge pales compared to so many and sometimes I have to change my viewpoint because I missed something or I’m in error.

  10. Bill says:

    There are many who profess, but do not practice. There are hypocrites in all religions. There are those that do not understand their belief especially when all you do is recite it. You need to know the source to understand the truth.

  11. William says:

    Giula,
    This is the Islamic belief.

    On judgement day those weighted by their bad deeds will remain in hell forever. There are some muslims that believe Allah can “rescue” people from hell as he chooses thus making hell empty.

    Fact is, there is no conclusive evidence of whether or not the Islamic hell is permanent or not. This is a theological debate just as the Christian hell can be debated theologically.

  12. tegis says:

    Then you believe wrong. 🙂 I understand very well the basic idea of federalism and that each state decides their own laws and respective relation to Christianity and other religions. But the fact that America was founded by nonconformists and other Christians and that most of these people that fled Europe just because ecclesiastical reasons were pretty much radicals and religious coconuts.
    I’m not defending Islam, I know its flaws and I hate that religion when it comes to certain parts. But Christianity was mal-practiced during most of its history, and still is in a lot of countries, i.e. in Poland and South America, don’t you think Islam can accept democracy after all? It’s halfway working in Dubai …

  13. Anonymous says:

    u ppl r retarded brown pride

  14. tegis says:

    Well thank you Sir for your highly intelligent remark. Please feel free to add some more of that deep-analyzing stuff you got there inside that membrane of yours …

  15. White Lightning says:

    I believe your all idiots! Nazism is the best thing that ever happened to humanity! It speaks the truth of human history. Hitler was the worlds messiah, and those goddamn allies took the possibility of a perfect world ruled by Nazi Germany! Had the Third Reich won the war, the would have cleansed & sterilized the world of all inferior races, such as the Jews(Semites), Mongoloids(East Asians & Amerindians), Malays(Pacific islanders), & most of all, the most savage & barbaric race of all, NEGROES(African Bushmen)! Their all sub-humans, poorly evolved colored peoples. The most advanced, evolved, civilized, & forward-thinking peoples of all are the Germanic races(Aryans, Anglo-Saxons, & Nordics)! All other non-Germanic peoples are inferior because their stagnant & down-trodden. The Nazis needed to conquer the world to prevent sub-humans from destroying highly advanced white civilization as well as spread the Master Race(Aryans) across the globe.

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